in decline

[culturejam]

Muffaletta they did something that is basically a DIY killer.

I'm pretty sure you can DIY a Muffaletta because it's all based around a CMOS IC multi-switch thingie (50 cents and readily available). It's just a lot of work to trace it because of all the parts.

Most of the DIY killers are digital: Red Panda, Nuenaber, etc. But even digital is quickly becoming a DIY mainstay.

But the real DIY killer, most likely, is (as has been mentioned) the $25 Chinese knockoffs of boutique and classic pedals. Can't buy the parts that cheap, so it sort of takes away *some* of the incentive for *some* of the builders. For me it was never really about cost/money, but for some people it probably is/was.

[Rockhorst]

true true

[pickdropper]

Another big thing is that digital is just so good now. I have a Kemper and it is really an unbelievable piece of gear. The Helix is an even more economical option and it is superb as well. If you can spend $1500 on a Helix and have everything you could ever want there is really no driving force to build. Shoot I probably have $1500 of pedal junk (at retail) in my basement right now.

Right now i build when I can because I enjoy it, but there's no urgency.

Digital gets better and better, almost exponentially. The Helix is already lightyears ahead of the original Red Bean, and for the first time a serious competition to Fractal's Axe-FX II. And they have recently released the Axe-FX III, which has ungodly amounts of DSP, 4 times as much. No more running out of CPU errors. Analog meanwhile can only improve incrementally. Even if we exclude the clones of existing classic pedals, which is basically most analog pedals, there's only so much you can do with analog electronics. And it doesn't help that more and more analog through hole components are disappearing. Making it harder for self sourcing newbies to get into the hobby. Most people I know already find classic through hole electronic soldering daunting, I can imagine they would be scared shitless by the idea of SMD electronic soldering.

The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful.  To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's.  It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow.  I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus.  I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.

[juansolo]

I've built all I want to for me and nobody is asking me to build guitar fx. Nothing new and interesting has really grabbed my interest that I've just had to build. So I've re-focused my need to tinker on old games consoles and computers. I've been restoring a load of those over the last year or so.

I did do some guitar electronics the other day in a couple of Cleggy's Felines. Lovely things.

[fair.child]

Another big thing is that digital is just so good now. I have a Kemper and it is really an unbelievable piece of gear. The Helix is an even more economical option and it is superb as well. If you can spend $1500 on a Helix and have everything you could ever want there is really no driving force to build. Shoot I probably have $1500 of pedal junk (at retail) in my basement right now.

Right now i build when I can because I enjoy it, but there's no urgency.

Digital gets better and better, almost exponentially. The Helix is already lightyears ahead of the original Red Bean, and for the first time a serious competition to Fractal's Axe-FX II. And they have recently released the Axe-FX III, which has ungodly amounts of DSP, 4 times as much. No more running out of CPU errors. Analog meanwhile can only improve incrementally. Even if we exclude the clones of existing classic pedals, which is basically most analog pedals, there's only so much you can do with analog electronics. And it doesn't help that more and more analog through hole components are disappearing. Making it harder for self sourcing newbies to get into the hobby. Most people I know already find classic through hole electronic soldering daunting, I can imagine they would be scared shitless by the idea of SMD electronic soldering.

The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful.  To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's.  It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow.  I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus.  I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.

Maybe it's time for us to learn some Juce API, do Kickstarter for open source Kemper/Fractal with TigerShark DSP hardware and grow it

[Muadzin]

The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful.  To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's.  It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow.  I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus.  I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.

Thing is though, space and time are curved and eventually the infinite comes around to its original position. If you are a guy who uses a couple of pedals into an amp then that setup is preferable to a classic 80's rack. But chances were those guys never had a rack to abandon in the first place. If you want more then just a boost, echo and some dirt, the pedal board will get bigger. In which case you need a good quality pedal board, reliable cabling, a good power supply. If you don't want to tap dance you need switchers, in which case you need more cabling, and some switchers come with presets controlling pedals like Strymon with MIDI. In which case you're basically back to that 80's rack, just in pedal board shape. 

Maybe it's time for us to learn some Juce API, do Kickstarter for open source Kemper/Fractal with TigerShark DSP hardware and grow it

Maybe I could. If only I could be arsed. Not meant as a snipe or insult, more of a sigh. I'm really too busy with way too many things.

[pickdropper]

The digital rack gear like AxeFX and Kemper is getting very sophisticated and quite wonderful.  To me, it represents the return of the rack gear that was so popular in the 80's and early 90's.  It'll certainly have an effect on the pedal industry, but I do think those things tend to ebb and flow.  I think the drive back towards pedals in the late 90's wasn't only because people didn't like the sound of digital rack gear (and it is much better now), but that many folks got tired of the complicated switching schemes involved in a rack setup and many preferred the simplicity of a handful of stomp boxes that they could dial in quickly without having to dig into sub-menus.  I loved my rack gear, but I did spend hours setting up presets.

Thing is though, space and time are curved and eventually the infinite comes around to its original position. If you are a guy who uses a couple of pedals into an amp then that setup is preferable to a classic 80's rack. But chances were those guys never had a rack to abandon in the first place. If you want more then just a boost, echo and some dirt, the pedal board will get bigger. In which case you need a good quality pedal board, reliable cabling, a good power supply. If you don't want to tap dance you need switchers, in which case you need more cabling, and some switchers come with presets controlling pedals like Strymon with MIDI. In which case you're basically back to that 80's rack, just in pedal board shape. 

Maybe it's time for us to learn some Juce API, do Kickstarter for open source Kemper/Fractal with TigerShark DSP hardware and grow it

Maybe I could. If only I could be arsed. Not meant as a snipe or insult, more of a sigh. I'm really too busy with way too many things.

I know quite a few people that went from rack gear back to the simplicity of pedals.  I also know folks that went Fractal and went back to simple analog pedals and folks that went Fractal and still love it.  It's difficult to argue that something like a Fractal rig can offer a vast array of options for gigging musicians in a smaller footprint.  One guy in particular I know is in a cover band and likes it because he can get close enough to a lot of famous sounds directly into the board.  He doesn't like it as much as the tube amps in his home studio, but he's sick of carrying a bigger rig around and it's a practical solution for him.

But yeah, if you have a Strymon rig with a ton of midi switching, the simplicity aspect isn't really there anymore.

[drog_trog]

Those that have climaxed and said that they've  built all they need, are they willing to share their eagle files?

[alanp]

I shared some of my old projects on oshpark, and someone downloaded them, got a load fabbed cheap from China, and started selling them themselves, with NO WORD to me. (I found out through a forumite letting me know.)

I'm kinda soured on the idea.

[chromesphere]

I shared some of my old projects on oshpark, and someone downloaded them, got a load fabbed cheap from China, and started selling them themselves, with NO WORD to me. (I found out through a forumite letting me know.)

I'm kinda soured on the idea.

Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though?  I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?

[somnif]

Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though?  I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?

There is a "Download" button next to the board order button on OSHPark listings. You get the .brd file directly.

I've appreciated it as it has helped me learn some tricks about board design, but I have never used them to order anything.

[chromesphere]

Thats pretty rough Alan...How did they download the files from OSHpark though?  I thought once you uploaded you couldnt download, even if you are the author of the files?

There is a "Download" button next to the board order button on OSHPark listings. You get the .brd file directly.

I've appreciated it as it has helped me learn some tricks about board design, but I have never used them to order anything.

What the hell, is that new?  Ive never even noticed that before!  Just reaffirms my stance on shared projects, dont share what you dont want exploited.  Its a shame there are unscrupulous people out there abusing others generosity....

[juansolo]

Those that have climaxed and said that they've  built all they need, are they willing to share their eagle files?

Ours are still with Rej for first refusal if Grind gets back off the ground. Otherwise ours will find another way to the DIYers that want to build them (probably me doing group buys).

[Rockhorst]

Those that have climaxed and said that they've  built all they need, are they willing to share their eagle files?

As stated by others, they shouldn't. A good layout can take a few nights work for bigger circuits. The author deserves some credit for that.

That said, But this place has such awesome resources that you shouldn't have to.

First off, If you need a board just PM the person who has produced/sold the board in the past and they will probably help you out. Or put up a request, I've a heap of PCB designs that I've never officially released, but I could help you out with simple stuff.

If all else fails, Brian has most awesomely shared his entire library with the community. This is what got a lot of people started with Eagle in the first place. Add Jakob's (jkokura) youtube series on Eagle (the best tutorial for pedal purposes) and you are good to go and make your own!

[aion]

From my perspective, being commercially involved in the DIY scene for over 5 years now, every year has been consistently better than the last. I half-quit my job last fall to focus on Aion and it has turned out to be a very good move.

As others have said, this topic has come up every year for the past few years. One characteristic I've noticed is that it always happens in the summer. The forums all have less discussion during the summer months. And my own sales will drop 10-30% as compared to September through May. It always picks back up.

But yes, there is also a bit of an effect where a lot of us "old timers" aren't really building for ourselves anymore so the hobby becomes more one of shooting the breeze and helping others be successful. That's the lifecycle of the hobby though. Tons of new builders all the time, but not many of them ever get beyond the intermediate level, because once you've built 10 pedals, you don't really need any new ones. So if you really are building them for the utility of it (e.g. having some cool pedals that you'll actually use) then you'll move on to something else before long. If you're building them for the fun of it, you might build several dozen, and will probably learn to design your own along the way, at which point you'll be less interested in new projects from others, but still very much actively involved in the community.