NRGPD!

[cooder]

... never received grand prize day!
Yay!

So without much further ado let me show you what I have received from Jacob as the Grand Prize of the fall competition:



Yes, that's right. There's an empty hand. Nothing.

Meanwhile the fall contest threads have dissappeared into the depth of the archives.
And, funny that, the threads can't be commented on any more. For that reason I'm putting this here and not in the fall contest threads where it would probably belong...

So just that you don't have to wade through the archives depth or strain your memory too much here's a quick rehash of timeline and communication I had with Jacob:

Competition deadline was 30 Nov 2014

intended judging first week of Dec 2014

intended winners anounncements second week of Dec 2014.

As most of us know winners announcement has been delayed until 17. Feb 2015.


17 Feb: Jacob sent me a PM to let me know that I have won the grand prize in fall competition, I replied same day and gave him my shipping address.
Heard nothing back, no shipping notification, no tracking number.

12 March : contacted Jacob, let him know that nothing has turned up yet and asked him for a tracking number.
He replied:"It's not in the mail yet, but it will be tomorrow!"
Heard nothing back, no shipping notification, no tracking number.


13 April, another month later, I let him know again that nothing has turned up yet and asked him for a tracking number.
He replied:
"Hey Cooder,

I wish I had tracking for you friend. I'll take a look through my receipts, but likely all we have is a customs number.

I am not surprised it's taking this long. Going from me to you, it's typical for packages to take longer than expected. Please keep me posted about when it comes in, but I wouldn't be surprised if it comes either later this week or perhaps the next.

Canada to NZ is often very slow. I'm sorry for that.

Jacob"

I've just PM'd Jacob to let him know that nothing has turned up here as yet of 01 May.
That's 72 days after letting Jacob know my shipping address. 151 days after competition deadline.

In my humble opinion it has been way too long and not acceptable, by any yardstick of comparison I can find.

Communication about this with Jacob wasn't exactly fruitful and has not changed anything of the facts that nothing has turned up here.
And I'm interestested to hear what this community, what you guys think.

Cheers
Stephan

PS:
I did by the way an order with much taunted Tayda on 26. April, that has turned up today.
All the way to New Zealand in 5 days, woohoo. And yes, Tayda sent a shipping notification and tracking number the day after I ordered.

[madbean]

Stephan,

I'm sorry you have not received the looper. However, I don't know what blame you can place on Jacob here. If it was mailed then there is little to nothing he can do to speed up delivery. That's entirely in the hands of the international carriers. I don't know how the Canadian post works, but with USPS you can get some basic info with a Customs #. For example, with a 1st Class shipment to NZ from TN I can track up to at least the point of departure from the last US sort facility (usually Miami). After that, you get zip and it's basically time to hold your breath and hope it gets there. And sometimes things take a long time for no reason at all. Hell, I just got back a package I sent to France last August.

So, I do think Jacob needs to give you the Customs # if he hasn't already (I don't know why he would not have). With that you should be able to check at your local Customs office in case they have held it for some reason. And, let me extend to you my guarantee that this will be made right one way or another. I completely understand your frustration and you have been very patient considering.

FYI: the contest threads are archived as a matter of process, not to prevent further discussion. I've done that with every contest sub-forum after a matter of months so there is nothing unusual with that.

[Govmnt_Lacky]

Don't really know what to say about this...... I don't want to bring up ill will so, I will just state the known facts.

As Stephan posted, it has been 151 days since the competition deadline. 72 days since sending address. Very little communication (unless initiated by Stephan) A long "apologetic" thread about "getting things straightened out" from 2.5 months ago. A message saying the package was sent out over 1.5 months ago. A $250-300 prize sent via snail mail with no tracking (or a tracking number provided)

I know that shipping to that part of the world can be slow however, I know that I have shipped flat rate international several times and it has never taken longer than 25 days AND tracking was all the way from receipt in the US to delivery in Australia and NZ. I do not run any kind of business but, I do know that if I am sending something worth that much, it will get shipped with tracking AND insured.

I appreciate Brian's willingness to step up and guarantee or ensure that this is made right however, is it really his job?


No.

I am quite sure that some will post on here to explain why it is still not there however, I think that Stephan has a genuine reason to be upset about this. He won that competition hands down and spent a great deal of time and effort in ensuring his win as well as abiding by the rules set forth. Its just a shame that this is happening. There really is no justification for what has transpired.

Think about it.... EVERYONE of the other declared winners has long received their promised reward. 

[jkokura]

Why don't you say what you really want to say Greg. I find it interesting to see that you've either been talking to Stephen directly about this or you feel it's necessary to be this forums watchdog. Repeatedly I've asked you to leave me alone, so I'll ask again in public - please stop. At this point this is none of your business, so please leave me alone. This is bordering on harassment.

I shipped on March 20 with 4-6 weeks shipping with Canada Post. I too would have expected it to arrive by today at the latest. Canada Post is not the same as USPS, and I have no idea what the New Zealand post is like. Comparing a package shipped from me in the middle of Canada to a package sent from Tailand to New Zealand isn't exactly fair.

I don't have excuses, but I want to be clear here - are you accusing me of not shipping and lying about it? Or are you accusing the mail service for taking way too long?

Quite frankly, I'm not sure what either of you want out of me. It's obvious your patience is at an end, but I'm not in control of the situation any longer. The prize will get there, or it won't because it's been lost or stolen. At that point I'm on the hook for an expensive prize still. That hasn't changed. If it hadn't been sent you might have a point. It was sent later than expected because an additional "I'm sorry it's late" bonus prize was added, and that took time to verify.

What do you want from me past that?

Jacob

[digi2t]

Canada Post surface parcel to New Zealand...

First leg, Regina to Vancouver...



Second leg, Vancouver to Auckland,



And by any miracle that the container makes it to NZ...



On the other hand (no pun intended), your life line does look fairly long, so you might just live long enough to see it.

[madbean]

Just to clarify:
cooder - it's absolutely fine that you decided to post this publicly. I understand and empathize with your frustration. We will make sure you get the prize and I did PM you earlier about how that will happen if this package gets lost.
Greg - You need to back off Jacob. The package was mailed. There is no point in re-hashing all this stuff from the contest. We all know what happened, both the good and the bad. And, I do run a business so I say with confidence that international shipping is always a gamble having shipped thousands of package worldwide every year. I personally spend at least a couple hundred dollars a year replacing lost shipments. It just happens sometimes.

[Govmnt_Lacky]

Why don't you say what you really want to say Greg. I find it interesting to see that you've either been talking to Stephen directly about this or you feel it's necessary to be this forums watchdog. Repeatedly I've asked you to leave me alone, so I'll ask again in public - please stop. At this point this is none of your business, so please leave me alone. This is bordering on harassment.

I shipped on March 20 with 4-6 weeks shipping with Canada Post. I too would have expected it to arrive by today at the latest. Canada Post is not the same as USPS, and I have no idea what the New Zealand post is like. Comparing a package shipped from me in the middle of Canada to a package sent from Tailand to New Zealand isn't exactly fair.

I don't have excuses, but I want to be clear here - are you accusing me of not shipping and lying about it? Or are you accusing the mail service for taking way too long?

Quite frankly, I'm not sure what either of you want out of me. It's obvious your patience is at an end, but I'm not in control of the situation any longer. The prize will get there, or it won't because it's been lost or stolen. At that point I'm on the hook for an expensive prize still. That hasn't changed. If it hadn't been sent you might have a point. It was sent later than expected because an additional "I'm sorry it's late" bonus prize was added, and that took time to verify.

What do you want from me past that?

Jacob

Watchdog? I am not an administrator on this forum.

What do I really want? I would like to see the OP get the prize he deserved.

None of my business? I wasn't addressing you Jacob. I was merely replying to a post on a public forum. It is not all about you Jacob.

Harassment? I am sorry you feel this way. If my stating my opinion regarding what has transpired and offering an opinion on how long it should take was construed, by you, as harassment then the only explanation I have for that is guilt. Do you feel that little old me, by myself, is ganging up on you?

What do I really want to say? You really don't want to know.

I like being a member here. I like helping people when I can. I have no business interest here. If you or Brian want to cut me loose then so be it. But DO NOT come on here and call me out FIRST... before even addressing the issue at hand with the OP... and attempt to deflect any of this on me. When I make or attempt a transaction with anyone I always make every effort to ensure things go smooth. That includes communicating with that person. My guess is that the OP wouldn't have even posted this if communication was better.

I am relatively new here compared to you Jacob. That does not mean I haven't been doing this for a long time. I have spent a lot of time attempting to build a good rapport with members here. Please do not deflect this issue on me merely because I commented on it, related facts, and stated an opinion which was totally separate and did not address... in any way.... anything particular to you and I.

[cooder]

Stephan,

I'm sorry you have not received the looper. However, I don't know what blame you can place on Jacob here. If it was mailed then there is little to nothing he can do to speed up delivery. That's entirely in the hands of the international carriers. I don't know how the Canadian post works, but with USPS you can get some basic info with a Customs #. For example, with a 1st Class shipment to NZ from TN I can track up to at least the point of departure from the last US sort facility (usually Miami). After that, you get zip and it's basically time to hold your breath and hope it gets there. And sometimes things take a long time for no reason at all. Hell, I just got back a package I sent to France last August.

So, I do think Jacob needs to give you the Customs # if he hasn't already (I don't know why he would not have). With that you should be able to check at your local Customs office in case they have held it for some reason. And, let me extend to you my guarantee that this will be made right one way or another. I completely understand your frustration and you have been very patient considering.

FYI: the contest threads are archived as a matter of process, not to prevent further discussion. I've done that with every contest sub-forum after a matter of months so there is nothing unusual with that.

Hi Brian,
thanks for chiming in on this and making a clear stand straight away. Many thanks also for your PM and your reassurance to get things straight one way or another.

Just to add to the information I have here on my side:
Jacob hasn't supplied me a custom number or anything like that, so I had no way of checking anything. I have PM'd Jacob several times about this asking for a tracking number or some info what's happening.

In my experience if something is held here in NZ by customs they are an efficient moneymaking machine, giving you an email notification with a phone number to leave your credit card details to pay x amount, thanks.
Then the parcel turns up two days later. I have heard nothing from customs in this case.

I wouldn't like to use the word "blame" on Jacob, because that sounds very righteous and opinionated, while I'm at least trying to just list the facts as they appear from my side.

So I prefer to use the word "criticise", as that's something which is less emotionally laden, and I certainly don't want to stir up emotional stuff and I don't want to get at Jacob for any personal reason.
I don't know him, he lives a continent away in the land of bears, moose and mounties. That's all I know.
He just happens to be the one who took charge of the contest and proceedings.

So I criticise Jacob for the poor communication I received from him since first PM on 17 Feb. and thus being in the unpleasant situation of having to chase this up.
Despite asking for a tracking number several times I didn't receive any info on shipment or actual date it went. Despite asking for a tracking number Jacob decided without checking with me first to send it the cheaper non-tracked way; a simple PM about this would have solved that. I would have been happy to pay for tracking.

This is after the difficult process and discussion the contest has been, very unfortunately and very unnecessary so.

I do find it personally disrespectful if people communicate poorly repeatedly with me.
That's just my personal standard and opinion.

So I do appreciate if I get taken serious by anyone and I have many many great and much appreciated dealings here with forum members which I find just super.

And apart from the Tayda shipping example I have received recently, all in a very timely and well communicated and much appreciated professional way, shipments from from Aion, two seperate pcb shipments from Brian/MB, a pcb from Ben/rullywow, a box of goodies organised kindly by jubal81/Jason. Heck, even a cute kitty greeting card filled with goodies from juansolo all the way from Yorkshire, woohoo.

In Jacobs case however I have to say, and I told him this directly in my PMs to him, I felt after several messages back and forth personally offended and also explained the reasons for that to him.

What I also criticise is that this is coming up after the humble pie thread and apologies etc.
Apart from a parcel possibly floating around somewhere in the universe (thanks fot the enlightening photos and my lifeline reading, very encouraging, digi2it!) I can't see any getting things straight after having things become difficult the first time around. The key issue mentioned in the discussion about the contest shortcomings was poor communication from Jacob, as he acknowledged and apologized for.

Apologies become a quickly devalued currency if you keep doing what you're doing.
Communication with Jacob has been poor in my opinion and in my eyes disrespectful, until this very day.
I have just after posting this received a PM from Jacob which I find in the context of my previous contact with him unpleasant and, to use a much overused word, bullying.

In that context, thanks Brian for reiterating that it's fine to post this publicly.

Also thanks to the members that have expressed their views so far and the PMs I have received regarding this, incl. cheerful images of shipping containers  .

[madbean]

Thanks for taking the time to offer your perspective. I'm listening, and it is valued. While I won't get in the middle of personal correspondence between you and Jacob I believe I have heard both sides now and understand how this situation came about. My commitment is in moving forward to bring this to a resolution.

I think the best course of action here is to set a reasonable date by which we will consider the shipment lost. My understanding is that the shipping method used was estimated at 4-6 weeks for delivery and today is the expiration of 6 weeks time. If I've got that wrong let me know. I think it would be good to provide a bit more of a buffer just to be sure but not more than a few more days before calling it lost. And, at that point I will work with you to fix the situation.. Is that agreeable?

[GrindCustoms]

The Surface shipping method from CAN is quite painfull, no tracking number are provided even if you pay an extra. The only way to get a tracking number with CanadaPost is priority international and the cost of that starts at 40$ and that's for shipping a very wee box...

Otherwise there's airmail with no tracking, it's usually 6 to 14 days but the cost will be 2 to 4 time the cost of surface method.

I've sent stuff to Oz couple time using the surface method, particularly to Ben (guitarmaggedon) and other customers that where ordering many pedals at once, it have taken up to 3months in certain case for the package to make it.

So yeah... it's a long way across the ocean in a SeaCan on a boat that goes 20mph... 

[cooder]

Hi Brian,
thanks again for being so straight forward and looking after this and my concerns, and all the great work that you do for this forum.
I very much appreciate that, also on the background that you must be a very busy guy.

I'm very happy with this suggestion and I also don't have any interest in digging up any personal stuff or carrying any grudges or so.

What would be a good timeline as your suggestion, seeing that you have more experience with international shipping and pitfalls?

Also, I would not like you personally to spend too much time on it, I think your time is much better spent on pumping out great projectys that we're all anticipate with sweaty palms (ain't that right, folks...?).
So, as you generously offered in PM to me to  build a replacement looper for me if needed, please don't do that!
I'm happy to receive the parts and put it together myself, it's after all what we love doing!
And no need to send me an enclosure, as I can bend my own alu enclosures here. Makes the shipping cheaper.


Many thanks for this great place!
Cheers
Stephan

[Luke51411]

The Surface shipping method from CAN is quite painfull, no tracking number are provided even if you pay an extra. The only way to get a tracking number with CanadaPost is priority international and the cost of that starts at 40$ and that's for shipping a very wee box...

Otherwise there's airmail with no tracking, it's usually 6 to 14 days but the cost will be 2 to 4 time the cost of surface method.

I've sent stuff to Oz couple time using the surface method, particularly to Ben (guitarmaggedon) and other customers that where ordering many pedals at once, it have taken up to 3months in certain case for the package to make it.

So yeah... it's a long way across the ocean in a SeaCan on a boat that goes 20mph... 

I'm in the US in a state touching Canada and usually it takes longer to receive something from Rej than from across the ocean. I've ordered from Thomas and Rej around the same time, they shipped within a couple days and I recieved my pcbs from Germany about a week earlier than Canada, go figure that one. Not that it has any bearing on this particular situation...

[madbean]

What would be a good timeline as your suggestion, seeing that you have more experience with international shipping and pitfalls?

Also, I would not like you personally to spend too much time on it, I think your time is much better spent on pumping out great projectys that we're all anticipate with sweaty palms (ain't that right, folks...?).
So, as you generously offered in PM to me to  build a replacement looper for me if needed, please don't do that!
I'm happy to receive the parts and put it together myself, it's after all what we love doing!
And no need to send me an enclosure, as I can bend my own alu enclosures here. Makes the shipping cheaper.

Okay, this is progress. Let's do a drop dead date of one week from today, May 8th, to allow for a surprise delivery. If it has not shown up by then I will send out everything you need minus the enclosure as you stated. It actually should work out to a fairly small package so I will send it Priority. That way it will be there within a week's time and we will have tracking for it. That's good for me so let me know if it works for you. 

[cooder]

Sweet. You're the man, Brian.
But we all know that 

[davent]

My last Tayda order, few and far between, was 25 days from them shipping to me signing for it, that's the norm.