Thoroughly off topic - RoadTrip holiday snaps

[wgc]

That's a fun trip!  Can't imagine a cooler driving experience.

One question:

What's the difference between overtaking and undertaking (no pun intended)

[Leevibe]

The word "epic" is so overused lately, but this qualifies! Stunning pics and those twisties must have been amazing in the Cayman.

[juansolo]

That's a fun trip!  Can't imagine a cooler driving experience.

One question:

What's the difference between overtaking and undertaking (no pun intended)

Ah overtaking, something most of the Europeans are better at than us British.

Overtaking is the act of 'making progress' or 'traveling some'. Depending on where you are this can be a joy or a little scary.

Germans - Used to people making progress, wind it up and run with your lights on and most will aid your overtake. On Autobahns/Autoroutes they get out of the way of quick moving cars.
Italians - Positively encourage fast driving, especially in sports cars. Giseppie in his Fiat van indeed ran with us through one of the passes using every inch of the road to keep up, and he did! Got a honk and a wave when we parted company. They'll also indicate right and pull over a little to aid an overtake. Oh and speed limits matter little in Italy.
Swiss - The polar opposite. They will actively try to kill you on the passes by closing gaps so you can't fit in, or accelerating a so you end up having to go twice as fast to get by them. They don't like sports cars in Switzerland for some reason. Speed limits and road rules are strictly enforced.
French & Austrians - Generally good.
Belgians - A menace on Autoroutes. They indicate and pull out as a single movement, swiftly and without warning/looking. You've got to be really on your toes if you're gunning it.

Undertaking is a Motorway thing in Britain (we're only allowed to overtake on the right). We have such poor lane discipline that people will pootle along all day in the middle or 'fast' lane when the 'slow' lane is completely empty. Basically because they're lazy. The rule is here that you should keep left unless overtaking. So many people, myself included get a little frustrated sometimes and undertake (overtake on the wrong side). Which then causes the undertakee to take exception to this, usually flash and gesticulate.

This comes down to our propensity for queuing as a people. We don't like people getting ahead of us. We'll go at our own damn speed and you'll just have to jolly well wait. It causes all sorts of problems and road rage amongst people who should really know better. We are some of the worst drivers in Europe IMO.

Merging is a perfect example. Where it makes sense to use all the lanes until the point the road narrows them merge in a zipper fashion. We'll create one giant queue in lane one, and people will refuse to let anyone in that is seen to be queue jumping (seriously, this is the logic). Some will actively go out of their way to block multiple lanes (usually British trucks) to stop people getting ahead of them. These people are idiots.

I have a rule personally. If someone is behind me now and they weren't a few secs/mins ago, they're going quicker than me and I'll let them by at my first opportunity to do so. Why wouldn't you? Driving in the UK really does suck balls compared to mainland Europe (well except Belgium and Switzerland).

[GrindCustoms]

I want to see that snow plower in action in a zombie movie!

[juansolo]

I want to see that snow plower in action in a zombie movie!

Not zombies, but if you get the uncut version of The Wolverine, there's some snow blower vs ninja action.

[Thomas_H]

John, your writing about overtaking is so true !

- but I always thought undertaking has to do with corpses - well, if you undertake as you describe on a german motorway it will lead to the former ;-)

[raulduke]

Nice road trip.

Glad you got to go up the cable at Zell am See as well.

I love that place. Strange to see it with no snow though 

[juansolo]

Very pretty and quite eerie up the top when all the walkers had left. It was so quiet that I could hear my ears ringing.

[mmlee]

That looks incredible, me and a mate have always talked about doing this (even though we have crap cars) maybe the time for late night pub chatting is over.

This makes my little camping trip up to the Dales in a couple weeks so insignificant, ha.

[m-Kresol]

It is funny, how I've heard of most of those places and haven't visited even half of them.

Your abstract about overtaking is soo true! I hope you didn't get any tickets in Switzerland, those are damn expensive (but in my opinion the right thing to do. Otherwise the laws/rules wouldn't have any sense to begin with).

Note to self: Make a shit ton of money and retire in Austria...

You don't need to be rich to retire in Austria (although it would definitively help ). But be warned: electronics are harder to come buy here than in the US...
Cheers

[wgc]

John, your writing about overtaking is so true !

- but I always thought undertaking has to do with corpses - well, if you undertake as you describe on a german motorway it will lead to the former ;-)

That was the pun I didn't want to make. 

Invaluable explanation, wish I'd had that when I was in Europe. It seems we truly are a melting pot here. The merge thing drives me nuts. Use both lanes up to the bitter end and just take turns...

[raulduke]

I don't want to piss on anyone's chips here... especially yours Juan... but I think undertaking is a d*ck move in most driving scenarios.

If someone did it to me I would be in a rage to be honest. Not because I'm an idiot, but because it is very dangerous.

I 100% agree on pulling over straight away for people going faster though. There does seem to be an awful lot of middle lane hoggers in the UK which can get very frustrating...

[juansolo]

I hope you didn't get any tickets in Switzerland, those are damn expensive (but in my opinion the right thing to do. Otherwise the laws/rules wouldn't have any sense to begin with).

Mostly on our best behavior in Switzerland, we were warned in advance about how they could be. I admit I got flashed my two speed cameras in Germany until I got my eye in with the KM/H vs MP/H thing. Thankfully no police though as that'd have cost me otherwise. In France on the way back we were tailed for about 5 mins by an unmarked gendarme. Thankfully my in-built paranoia radar saw him rapidly approaching and I radioed the guy behind to reign it in a little.

So no fines on this trip 

[juansolo]

I don't want to piss on anyone's chips here... especially yours Juan... but I think undertaking is a d*ck move in most driving scenarios.

If someone did it to me I would be in a rage to be honest. Not because I'm an idiot, but because it is very dangerous.

I 100% agree on pulling over straight away for people going faster though. There does seem to be an awful lot of middle lane hoggers in the UK which can get very frustrating...

I'm from Yorkshire, I can undertake politely I rarely get noticed never mind gesticulated at as they're usually bimbling along oblivious as to what's going on around them. It usually takes me a while to resort to it, I have two bright red cars and if they don't see me behind them or they don't move, they're never going to. It is possibly to undertake like a wanker, this is dangerous however. That's the 'I'll teach you how to drive attitude' another charming British trait...

I like the continental approach of putting on your right hand indicator to show that you want to pass, more polite than flashing. It's just people are too stupid, stubborn or just take pleasure in holding other people up. I've no idea what it is. I genuinely think it's pure laziness. Get in the 'fast' lane, wind it up to 70 and just sit there until you have to leave the motorway. Anyone going faster than you is obviously breaking the law so fuck them. Why should they have to move out of the way for these law breakers...? It's a shitty attitude however you look at it, if they're genuinely unaware of what's going on around them then it's driving without due care and attention which is FAR more dangerous than speeding.

IMO we give licenses out too easily and the highway code isn't thorough enough (neither of which is hard to address). It's certainly not enforced like it used to be. There's a lot of shit in there that we could do better (the merging thing above for example). As it is, driving standards in this country are woeful. Driving on the continent (anywhere but Belgium) re-enforces that. We just need a change in attitude. Sadly it's easier to brainwash the public with the 'Speed Kills' mantra. Which is certainly a factor in the severity of the accident, but it very much doesn't address the cause. Which is usually driving without due care and attention, being distracted (the same), driving with no regard to the conditions (the same) or driving like a wanker.

This may be a little bug bear of mine.

...and while I'm outlining my transport policy I'd also switch everything (signs/speedos) to the metric system. I was part of the last generation that did both, the generation that followed has no f**king clue how many yards make up a mile. It's time for it to go. ALL cars have both on them, they have for years, it's time to let go of this archaic system.

An added advantage of this would be to get the 130KPH speed limit in for motorways without triggering the outrage of minority government funded pressure groups like Brake.

[juansolo]

I think I'm done now...