madbeanpedals is going to evolve into its next iteration very soon. This means many new original projects of my own design, updated classics (including some that have not been available as DIY projects before), and some modified, improved versions of existing designs. I'm very excited about taking this direction, and I think it will help evolve the business of madbeanpedals. I hope it will also excite this little community we have to try out new things and also have more opportunity to give its input into where this beautiful monstrosity is headed.
This also means its time to start drawing down on some of the existing clone projects. Specifically, I intend to let the current stock of some of the manufactured boards expire. I also do not plan on doing straight up clones of currently manufactured "boutique" type effects any longer. While this is a somewhat nebulous label, I think most people here understand what I'm getting at. And, this doesn't mean I won't release something that I can make interesting modifications to, or offer an improved design, as is the case with the LaVache most recently. At the same time, I have little interest in straight up clones anymore.
It's important to convey that as madbeanpedals grows, so does its profile and so does the risk of pissing off the wrong people. And, I'm taking a bit of heat right now because of this. I've taken a lot of care in setting ground rules in terms of restricting the use of the materials to the realm of DIY. While the vast majority of people understand and abide by this, there are a few that have taken advantage of it in ways I would prefer them not to. This is not an admonishment of any specific customer or member here in any way. Rather, it's an indicator to me that the model I'm trying to develop this business around isn't perfect, and needs to be tweaked. Any negative reflection on madbeanpedals by the DIY community or beyond is my own failure and no one else.
So, rather than trying to continue to walk a very fine line which I've been on for some time, it just seems a lot easier to change course a bit. This does not mean that a bunch of projects will "disappear" overnight. It only means that I'm going to be much more selective about the things I offer for sale.
To give everyone an idea of what to expect, this is the list of PCBs that I will be letting go of once the current stock expires:
Firebomb, Slambox, Boomstick, Sabertooth, Zombii, Macheen, Poindexter, Aristocrat, Darkside, Serendipity, Sunking and the Yellow Shark.
Additionally, the Dig Dug, Quasar and Mysterioso projects have been canceled. Others may be added to this list, but I have not made any final decisions. I do intend to develop a sequencer project like the Dig Dug. It just won't be a clone.
I have a decent amount of stock left on the ones mentioned above, so there's no need to rush and buy anything. This is not a sales tactic. It's just a warning that once they are gone, they are gone for good.
Anyway, I welcome any feedback that members here have to offer. I do hope that people understand that I have good reasons for changing course, and that I don't make drastic changes without a lot of thought and planning. I hope I do not lose customers or members in the process, of course. But, I also hope that we continue to grow together and make this place fun and exciting for everyone!
Cheers,
Brian
I can totally understand this decision. It will give you a clean conscience with your business I guess which is very important.
I also think there are enough existing designs, along with your new ones, that can be tweaked and tailored to get great sounds without treading on the toes of any boutique makers.
If this is your business and your sole means of income then it stands to reason that you don't want to be rubbing other people who make a living out of making pedals up the wrong way.
Anyway, I don't know about everyone else, but it seems that the mystique around boutique pedals has kind of evaporated in the past few years. I think guitar players/musicians now realise that what they are actually paying for is the build quality and attention to detail of boutique pedals, not some mysterious, secret, 'mojo' ingredient. Therefore I think (hope?) that things may calm down with people wanting clones of specific pedals, and may be more open to other options.
There are certain boutique pedal makers who I don't really feel any sympathy for with the cloning issues as I think they are charging way too much already (I won't mention any names), but there are also manufacturers (Skreddy, Catalinbread, Subdecay, Earthquaker Devices etc.) who seem like decent people, creating decent designs, and are selling their stuff for a reasonable price. Its these guys that I don't like to imagine are missing out due to other people selling clones of their stuff.
this change is somewhat welcome, would be more interesting to see how things go.
on another note though, cancelling the darkside and sunking is bad(IMO) because they are GREAT sounding pedals, on their own, they are much different than anything i've ever tried and i don't think you should retire them.
awesome. i really respect madbeanpedals for continually evolving. and i can see why you would make this change. i really look forward to it!
it is a shame about the sunking, its such a nice sounding circuit, but im glad i got to build my own while i still could :)
cheers for more original designs. I think brian is a great designer!
Here's a thumbs up for more original designs from me too.
It is a shame about the Sunking but if the build documents are still going to be there at least you can etch your own board.
Dude, I admire your work ethic, passion and hard work for the DIY community.
I think you're making the right decision and taking a leap into an unknown realm of new things that I know will transform all of us for the better.
I don't know about the rest of you guys, but my end-goal on participating on the DIY community is to be able to learn how these things work and eventually DESIGN my own. Not to live all my life building other people's stuff.
That being said, I think Brian is enabling all of us to reach that goal and he has already started with this. (The open-source Tube Screamer project for example)
Brian, like I said, I really admire you for making all of this happen for us and I honestly cannot wait to see what the future of Madbean will be. It's gonna be INTENSE....
THANKS BRIAN!
-Kaleb
I had a feeling this was coming based on the evolution of the text on the projects page, disclaimer, etc... I think a lot of us in the hobby are outgrowing "clones" right along with you Bean.
I think This change is only going to be good for you us and the hobby itself.
I think you're making the right decision. You already have established a rep for high quality, so it's time to start making your own mark. Personally, I would rather build a cool project that's somewhat unique & customized. Looking forward to your new stuff!! I like new. :)
No surprise to me...
I'm glad to see you take on the new direction and I for one will continue to support what's going on here!
Onward and upwards! ;D
Josh
QuoteI don't know about the rest of you guys, but my end-goal on participating on the DIY community is to be able to learn how these things work and eventually DESIGN my own. Not to live all my life building other people's stuff.
What He Said!
Steering in this new direction is all but inevitable. It's very exciting, and I can't wait for all the cool new madbean projects!
Quote from: Haberdasher on May 26, 2011, 05:04:13 PM
Steering in this new direction is all but inevitable. It's very exciting, and I can't wait for all the cool new madbean projects!
+1, I think you have great judgment on what changes will sound good. Does this mean the May 30th batch of Sunking's is cancelled? I ordered a bunch of parts for mine last weekend.
Quote from: JakeFuzz on May 26, 2011, 05:10:23 PM
Quote from: Haberdasher on May 26, 2011, 05:04:13 PM
Steering in this new direction is all but inevitable. It's very exciting, and I can't wait for all the cool new madbean projects!
+1, I think you have great judgment on what changes will sound good. Does this mean the May 30th batch of Sunking's is cancelled? I ordered a bunch of parts for mine last weekend.
Thanks!
The incoming Sunkings are not canceled. But they are presumably the last to be stocked. There might be a pretty nice sale coming to MBP here in a few days, too :)
I think this is a great idea and a great new direction, Brian. :)
I fully understand how it turns out, and I'll still be there checking the forum daily, and ordering new crazy stuff ;)
Btw I hope you'll sell the fuzz board with mounted jacks and perf board you've shown one day, to develop our own projects. Like Kaleb said I'd be proud to post my own layout one day in the member projects section :)
+1 to what they all said before.
I noticed the recent addition of "TM)"'s to your project page, which made me think "did he get a complaint from a company?"
One thing I did enjoy about the previous format was the ability to pick "flavors" based on big names and guitar demo videos. But I'm super excited about your announcement :D I'll ask the question no one else has: when? (specifically the mobius, and organ donor/ugly face)
intrigued by this sale...I kicked myself for not throwing in a MBP sticker with my recent order--plus I had bad timing :'(
I feel ya. I placed an order yesterday..... but its all good as I am more than happy to place another.
Congrats to Brian for moving forward and growing/evolving. I cant wait to hear more of your designs.
I don't think anything you said is unreasonable in any way. It's too bad people are giving you trouble as your clearly not doing this to rip anyone off and get rich. But that means a new door is opening and more madbean designs is always great news to my ear! We have a great community going here and I believe everyone will support you, especially with big new steps! Keep up the great work Brian! Can't wait to see what you got in store for us ;D
I'll certainly miss some of those projects! Looks like I'll have to try my own hand at a few layouts...
Thanks for the update Brian.
Jacob
Ahh the elusive fabb'd Mysterioso! That thing is more rare than bigfoot! Here's a quote from an old Sandman comic book:
"Um, what's the name of the word for things not being the same always? You know, I'm sure there is one. Isn't there? There must be a word for it ... the thing that lets you know time is happening. Is there a word?"
"Change."
Looking forward to the new shizz, Brian!
I think with this new change in direction my advice would be do do some good demos of the unique/new projects. You could even ask us builders to do them. I think that will be invaluable for helping sell them. Right now we can easily pull up a demo of a pedal that is a clone on YouTube but, when you see a new project it's harder to really "want/need" to buy it unless you have a good handle on what it is and does.
Like most people have wanted a Sunking because we know what it is and how hard/expensive the original is to get. Something that really can drive that G.A.S. factor.
The only thing I worry about is being able to stay afloat moving forward if all the "clones" are gone, as I think that's what draws some people in initially. Hopefully the more "classic" circuits will stay around longer. I totally understand not wanting to carry current production clone boards though. It is a fine line on some of those--the ones you mention I can easily see why they would be pulled.
Right now, I think yours is the best place to buy PCB projects in general and I will be honest that so far I have only bought "clone" boards, mainly because I know what to expect. That doesn't mean I won't buy new unique projects now that I know what I'm doing. But, that brought me here and I think for a newbie, seeing a bunch of unique projects may not necessarily bring them in the door. But if they had some good demos I think it would make more people want them because they couldn't get them anywhere else.
I'm sure you have a better handle on what sells and what the community is that buys your boards than I do. Just wanted to offer my honest thoughts.
J
Thanks for all the feedback, guys. In response to some points brought up here...
Without going into detail, the decision was made based on some complaints/threats that were made to me. While I have already resolved the matter, the decision to discontinue some projects is my own and was not a result of anything other than my desire to avoid further entanglements.
For the most part, all the conversations I've had with different pedal manufacturers over the last couple years have been good ones, and in cases where requests were made I always complied. I've remained professional and courteous in those interactions, and emphasized the nature of what goes on here is DIY and not at all about hurting anyone. Of course, some people are not going to see it that way, and that cannot be helped. But, in my defense, I have tried to lead by example by sticking to my own ideals, i.e. not selling clone pedals in any sort of commercial context and further by creating an actual environment of learning and education.
But, I'm not hard-headed and it's clear that "the writing is on the wall" to grow and change this place a bit. If not, I might start having to spend a lot of time dealing with hateful emails, threats, blah blah. And that will jeopardize the work I've done (and the large amount of money I've invested) to make MBP a reality. And also make the work a whole lot less fun, too.
Anyway, that's pretty much all I have to say about it. There is still a good stock of the soon-to-be-discontinued PCBs and I will have a pretty rad sale posted here in a couple of days. No one will miss out if there is a project they still want to try.
You can also expect a deluge pretty soon of new projects. I'm nearing completion on a good five or six, including the Univibe, Electric Mistress, Dipthonizer, a new delay, and a couple others.
mmmmmmmmmmm...vibe!!!
Quote from: madbean on May 27, 2011, 04:16:30 PM
... I have tried to lead by example by sticking to my own ideals, i.e. not selling clone pedals in any sort of commercial context and further by creating an actual environment of learning and education.
I'm behind you 100%, and eager to learn. ;)
Quote
There is still a good stock of the soon-to-be-discontinued PCBs and I will have a pretty rad sale posted here in a couple of days. No one will miss out if there is a project they still want to try.
You can also expect a deluge pretty soon of new projects. I'm nearing completion on a good five or six, including the Univibe, Electric Mistress, Dipthonizer, a new delay, and a couple others.
If it's not too greedy sounding, I'll take one of everything. ;D
THREE CHEERS FOR BRIAN!!!
Vibe would be awesome. Especially if it was smaller than the other vibe boards for sale elsewhere.
-Aaron
P.S. - I understand where you're coming from with discontinuing the clones. Life is too short to have to deal with that kind of unpleasantness.
It makes me glad I got in here when I did! If for nothing else, it has shown me that the builds Brian puts out are not complete clones because they may even sound better than the originals. That being said, this guy is going to continue to put out killer stuff!
Also I'm def going to buy a sun king or 2 as I really want to try it!! 'Can't wait for the electric mistress!
Thanks for everything that everyone has contributed so far into this fantastic hobby lifestyle!
-Justin
I'm ready as can be! Honestly this is the most exciting news to me yet.
Are you still gonna have the documents available for people who wanna try these older projects once you stop selling the boards?
Quote from: aflynt on May 27, 2011, 05:31:49 PM
Vibe would be awesome. Especially if it was smaller than the other vibe boards for sale elsewhere.
-Aaron
There actually might be two vibe projects. One for a 125B and another for either a wah shell or 1590BB :) They will most likely have somewhat different features.
Quote from: madbean on May 27, 2011, 07:37:43 PM
Quote from: aflynt on May 27, 2011, 05:31:49 PM
Vibe would be awesome. Especially if it was smaller than the other vibe boards for sale elsewhere.
-Aaron
There actually might be two vibe projects. One for a 125B and another for either a wah shell or 1590BB :) They will most likely have somewhat different features.
Awesome!
-Aaron
Quote from: madbean on May 27, 2011, 07:37:43 PM
There actually might be two vibe projects. One for a 125B and another for either a wah shell or 1590BB :) They will most likely have somewhat different features.
2 vibes. :o crap. I gotta unsubscribe from this thread, it's killing me! :)
Brian,
Best of luck on this venture. It's pretty obvious that you have a legion of loyal customers that are ready to back you up... and with good reason. You provide a great service and great products. Just promise that there will always be stuff for the more stompbox-challenged of us to work on!
Looking forward to the new MBP.
Thanks
Keith
Quote from: jcuempire on May 27, 2011, 08:42:05 PM
It's pretty obvious that you have a legion of loyal customers that are ready to back you up... and with good reason. You provide a great service and great products.
Yep. That about sums it up. And, in case I haven't said it before, thanks Brian!
Quote from: maysink on May 27, 2011, 03:23:17 AM
Ahh the elusive fabb'd Mysterioso! That thing is more rare than bigfoot!
I'll consider doing the single channel version of this again. I feel that's enough modification not to get anyone too riled up.
Same goes for the King of Klones, the single channel KOT. I'll continue to offer that one.
Good to know! I was wanting to try both of those down the road and was hoping that a single version of them would be available (and enough difference to keep from being harassed)
In case I missed saying it as well, Thank you Brian! You're the freaking man!
When do you think this sale will take place?
Not that I need to spend any more money right now but, I want to be prepared you know! :P
J
Quote from: Myramyd on May 30, 2011, 05:47:29 PM
When do you think this sale will take place?
Not that I need to spend any more money right now but, I want to be prepared you know! :P
J
It could be a.... Memorial Day sale! ;D
Quote from: JakeFuzz on May 30, 2011, 05:50:39 PM
It could be a.... Memorial Day sale! ;D
:o ;D Thats what I'm hoping for!
While it's a shame to drop some really fantasitic boards, I totally understand why you're doing it. All power to you fella.
I am eagerly awaiting the arrival of the sequencer project! I'd love to build me a sequenced tremolo ;D
Keep it up!