With the lack of small wedge shaped boxes being available for DIY builders, I thought it might be a cool idea to have some made. I kicked around some thoughts with a friend of mine who knows a lot about sheet metal fabrication, and came up with this:
(http://imageshack.com/a/img802/6785/r4hd.jpg)
It's a bit larger in all directions than a 1590B. The flat part is large enough to accommodate two chickenhead knobs, for all you vintage fuzz freaks. It's assembled from two parts like this:
(http://imageshack.com/a/img837/8691/q29x.jpg)
The holes and screws needed for assembly aren't in the model yet.... For size reference I also have a pic that includes some knobs, a stomp switch and a 1590B:
(http://imageshack.com/a/img841/1166/lwx4.jpg)
I'm thinking of getting some quotations for the cost of having this made (my friend has some contacts in that business), and because a small run would be more cost effective than 1 or 2 singles, would this be of interest to any of you if the cost remained reasonable? Finally, some questions:
- how much would you be willing to pay for a box like this? IOW: what do you think is 'reasonable'?
- any problems you see with the design?
- anything you would like to see added/changed?
Thanks in advance for any input you might have on this!
Paul
I'm interested, depending on cost per box.
I've got no idea on what would be a reasonable price for them though.
Sent from my thumbs using Tapatalk!
I'm interested in seeing what you can come up with. I priced out some boxes that were similar from a couple of places close by to me and the prices were insane -- like government pork levels of insane.
Is the top (fat) part of the box big enough to do top mounted jacks under the pots there?
Cost wise, I'll have to think about this for a bit, but the price competition points could be considered to be things like the cool shaped Hammonds. Still, as a special one-off kinda thing, I could see paying a bit more than that.
Size wise, personally, I'd like it to either have the same footprint as the 1590B or be increased in size up to the footprint of the 1590BB or maybe even a tiny bit bigger.
Great looking box. I don't know if you'd ship them to the US, but I don't think they'd be too popular if price + shipping is much more than about $15.
Quote from: RobA on February 02, 2014, 02:05:54 PM
I'm interested in seeing what you can come up with. I priced out some boxes that were similar from a couple of places close by to me and the prices were insane -- like government pork levels of insane.
Is the top (fat) part of the box big enough to do top mounted jacks under the pots there?
Cost wise, I'll have to think about this for a bit, but the price competition points could be considered to be things like the cool shaped Hammonds. Still, as a special one-off kinda thing, I could see paying a bit more than that.
Size wise, personally, I'd like it to either have the same footprint as the 1590B or be increased in size up to the footprint of the 1590BB or maybe even a tiny bit bigger.
Thanks for the comments, Rob. The top mounted jacks are certainly possible, I've been modelling some more in Autocad, and the design leaves ample clearance over both 1/4" and DC jacks. Price-wise, the Hammond pricepoint is very hard to beat, but on the upside, expanding to 1590BB size would add very little to the cost, since the manufacturing is probably the most expensive.
Quote from: jubal81 on February 02, 2014, 02:19:33 PM
Great looking box. I don't know if you'd ship them to the US, but I don't think they'd be too popular if price + shipping is much more than about $15.
I'd be more than happy to ship to the US Jubal, but if this were to go forward, I'd need to team up with somebody across the ocean to do some re-distributing, otherwise the shipping for each individual order would be rediculous! I think I can send maybe 8-10 for about 25 euros including tracking.....
I'll try to get some quotes soon, but I've been considering other options as well, including doing part of the production myself..... We'll see where this leads!
Paul
more pics, now including in/out jacks, +9V jack and LED. As you can see, plenty of space to house a pcb and more pots, switches etc.
(http://imageshack.com/a/img607/6788/qmk1.jpg)
(http://imageshack.com/a/img36/27/4y1n.jpg)
Paul
Looking good, I'm really interested. Any ideas on the materials at this point?
Down for a couple if you will do.
Mich P.
I'd like a little bit more area on the top deck (for 2 rows of knobs)
I too am very interested in some, just really depends on cost and shipping for me. Look forward to see where this goes. Your mockups look great also.
I'd get some. The real question isn't if you can get them made, it's whether they come powdercoated or not.
What's the chance you partner with Steve or Cole in getting the painted?
Jacob
Quote from: jkokura on February 04, 2014, 06:18:12 PM
I'd get some. The real question isn't if you can get them made, it's whether they come powdercoated or not.
What's the chance you partner with Steve or Cole in getting the painted?
Jacob
That's a really interesting thought Jacob. I really like what the results might be, but the shipping would increase two-fold: first from me to Steve or Cole, then from them to you, and all parties should at least break even, cost-wise. There's two ways to solve this, and both won't work: First, me and Steve/Cole/Whoever could charge all the shipping to the guys buying the boxes, which results in a price almost nobody is willing to pay. Second, I could invest in a powdercoating setup and do it myself, but I really don't have a space to do that (Mrs. Dutch wouldn't like me baking those boxes in our appartments kitchen!). Still, it is an interesting thought, and now it's stuck in my brain! ;)
I'll get a quote for the manufacturing first, and then see what I can do powder wise. Thanks for thinking ahead Jacob!
Paul
I'd be down for a couple if this moves forward. I also am game to ship these out to other USA brethren as I am well equipped with shipping supplies/label creation. I do have a powder coating setup and would consider coating them for interested parties. Let see where this goes! Nice job so far, Paul.
To throw a wrench at the monkey....
Looking at how the 2 pieces fit together, it looks like you will HAVE to use foot bumpers of some sort as the only way to secure both pieces of the enclosure together will mean having the screw heads exposed at the bottom :-\
Any way you could incorporate some small-ish tabs on the bottom to give it a hinged open/close ability?
Good point. Either the screw holes need relief so you can use the pan-head style screws we typically use for boxes, or you need to put the fasteners on the sides of the enclosure.
Also, have you thought about having a machine shop also powdercoat them? For example, you can order 100 of them, and get them for $X.YZ per box, then have them all powdercoated by a local shop for $X.YZ and then adding those costs together plus your upcharge.
I think if the design makes sense, the cost isn't prohibative, and the colour(s) are attractive, you'd have no problem selling 100 of those boxes. I'd bet if you did runs of the right number you'd probably be okay.
Hard part of any business is the startup capital. You'll likely be shelling out $500-700 before anyone buys anything, and you have to think about boxes and foam to pad the enclosures you ship, and all sorts of things like that.
You sure you're ready for this Paul?
Jacob
Lots of good points made so far, thanks for thinking ahead with me!
Quote from: jkokura on February 04, 2014, 08:19:46 PM
You sure you're ready for this Paul?
I'm not sure Jacob, not at all! But from all the positive feedback so far, it sure is worth persuing it a bit further. That will have to wait though, as I'm leaving for London with Mrs. Dutch tomorrow. And there is also the busy dayjob to consider.... I'll keep you all posted, thanks again for your feedback!
Paul
Quote from: Govmnt_Lacky on February 04, 2014, 07:56:02 PM
To throw a wrench at the monkey....
Looking at how the 2 pieces fit together, it looks like you will HAVE to use foot bumpers of some sort as the only way to secure both pieces of the enclosure together will mean having the screw heads exposed at the bottom :-\
Any way you could incorporate some small-ish tabs on the bottom to give it a hinged open/close ability?
If the bottom lips of the centre section had tabs on each side perpendicular the that bottom lip, the two pieces could secured through the side rather then up through the bottom and then the back set of screws could function as a hinge.
dave
I really don't want to stop any of the DIY spirit here, I just wanted to let you guys see this:
http://www.musikding.de/MDC-432
http://www.musikding.de/MDC-532
http://www.musikding.de/MDC-752
EDIT: I just checked the shipping costs. without tracking and probably taking forever (I'm currently waiting on an order shipped 2 weeks ago for a distance of 5h by car) it's 4,5€ to the US. with tracking number it's 35€ so more than double the price of the enclosure...
I guess, it's back to Paul then!
Quote from: m-Kresol on February 04, 2014, 09:48:05 PM
I really don't want to stop any of the DIY spirit here, I just wanted to let you guys see this:
http://www.musikding.de/MDC-432
http://www.musikding.de/MDC-532
http://www.musikding.de/MDC-752
EDIT: I just checked the shipping costs. without tracking and probably taking forever (I'm currently waiting on an order shipped 2 weeks ago for a distance of 5h by car) it's 4,5€ to the US. with tracking number it's 35€ so more than double the price of the enclosure...
I guess, it's back to Paul then!
I think the slant is to steep on these ones and the one that is being designed by DutchMF will be better for stomp effects. Just my thought.
I'd be down for a few if they were not powder-coated (I like to etch), and if shipping stateside is not too crzy
Mac Walker over at DIYSB had something similar. 48 shipped for 4 boxes US.
Quote from: Clayford on February 05, 2014, 03:00:53 AM
Mac Walker over at DIYSB had something similar. 48 shipped for 4 boxes US.
End of last month he posted here that they're now 5 for $50, unfortunately only to continental US, but i managed to get four before the shipping embargo and they are really nice, a flat roomy wedge.
http://www.madbeanpedals.com/forum/index.php?topic=13616.0
There is another US only option on ebay for steel enclosures, search there under Superfuzz.
I would absolutely LOVE an unfinished (or even powdercoated) Rat-style box. Like the current Rat 2 / Turbo Rat size. I could live without the battery door, which would save in machining costs.
Or maybe slightly smaller all around would be idea. But I love the height and the accessibility when building.
(http://ratdistortion.com/wp-content/themes/ratdistortion/i/products/rat2_1_large.jpg)
Looks like you guys would have the skill and know-how to make re-issues of the great 70's style EXH deluxe enclosures. Those would be perfect for complicated and mult-effects. Lots of space for knobs. I'm sure there would be a market...
Quote from: lars on February 05, 2014, 05:34:48 AM
Looks like you guys would have the skill and know-how to make re-issues of the great 70's style EXH deluxe enclosures. Those would be perfect for complicated and mult-effects. Lots of space for knobs. I'm sure there would be a market...
I have an enclosure I bought on DIYstomp a few years back that is a clone of the EHX Small Stone/Clone size. I used one for a Muff build, and the other is still sitting here waiting on some "special" project. :)
Quote from: lars on February 05, 2014, 05:34:48 AM
Looks like you guys would have the skill and know-how to make re-issues of the great 70's style EXH deluxe enclosures. Those would be perfect for complicated and mult-effects. Lots of space for knobs. I'm sure there would be a market...
+1^^^
This would be a great idea. Especially since there has been a resurgence of big-box EHX projects lately.
I would be interested too, it looks more pedal oriented than the hammond ones, which have too much slope and feel a little weak to me.
And as other have commented, I wouldn't mind having a Rat style one or EHX kind of boxes. Also I´d like something in the style of the classic maestro fuzz.
Between 10 and 15 would be reasonable for me,
Paul, I'd be interested if you can make this happen. I think one of these would be perfect for a vero Fuzz Face I built up and tested recently.
Quote from: davent on February 05, 2014, 03:10:04 AM
Quote from: Clayford on February 05, 2014, 03:00:53 AM
Mac Walker over at DIYSB had something similar. 48 shipped for 4 boxes US.
End of last month he posted here that they're now 5 for $50, unfortunately only to continental US, but i managed to get four before the shipping embargo and they are really nice, a flat roomy wedge.
http://www.madbeanpedals.com/forum/index.php?topic=13616.0
There is another US only option on ebay for steel enclosures, search there under Superfuzz.
I think that's someone that bought the 10 pack and is trying to split them off.
Paul, Do you have cutting plans for these that I could have ? I might be able to get a couple made up here at work
Quote from: Clayford on February 05, 2014, 03:25:37 PM
Quote from: davent on February 05, 2014, 03:10:04 AM
Quote from: Clayford on February 05, 2014, 03:00:53 AM
Mac Walker over at DIYSB had something similar. 48 shipped for 4 boxes US.
End of last month he posted here that they're now 5 for $50, unfortunately only to continental US, but i managed to get four before the shipping embargo and they are really nice, a flat roomy wedge.
http://www.madbeanpedals.com/forum/index.php?topic=13616.0
There is another US only option on ebay for steel enclosures, search there under Superfuzz.
I think that's someone that bought the 10 pack and is trying to split them off.
Aaah, ok, never thought of that, still... good deal on some nice enclosures.
dave
I just finished a rehouse of an Arion SAD-1 in a very similar case I bought at Fry's. It was raw aluminum. I painted the sides and wrapped the top with dollar store contact paper to get the look I wanted.
To make it stomp worthy I had to add the reinforcing tube to hold the sides from collapsing out. This was the smallest enclosure I could find that would fit the board.
Since I am from EU I will definetly buy a couple of those....
I used one from Frys one time also and found the slope to be to steep for my foot. I think DutchMF is on the right track and would love to see something fabbed for a series of classic fuzz' I am working on.
Would still like to see some big box EHX enclosure clones! ;D
Quote from: selfdestroyer on February 06, 2014, 05:11:36 PM
I used one from Frys one time also and found the slope to be to steep for my foot. I think DutchMF is on the right track and would love to see something fabbed for a series of classic fuzz' I am working on.
Agreed. A shallower slope would be nice. Heavier gauge aluminum would be good too. The one I used could have been much thicker and it still would have been plenty light and a little more stomp-worthy. The surprising thing about sloped enclosures is the lack of useable space compared to the footprint.
Thanks for all the input, guys! I just got home from a short trip and will try to get this thing rolling asap. I'm going with the design I have at the moment for now, and will put some more thought in it (space for knobs, how to mount the two parts together etc.) if it seems like this is going to happen. Price will be the main point though, fingers x-d!
Paul
This is something I am interested in but cost seems to be the limiting factor...
There might be a prototype made real soon, with some assistance from another forum member. I'll keep you all posted!
Paul
Quote from: culturejam on February 05, 2014, 04:54:37 AM
I would absolutely LOVE an unfinished (or even powdercoated) Rat-style box. Like the current Rat 2 / Turbo Rat size. I could live without the battery door, which would save in machining costs.
Or maybe slightly smaller all around would be idea. But I love the height and the accessibility when building.
(http://ratdistortion.com/wp-content/themes/ratdistortion/i/products/rat2_1_large.jpg)
The wedge box is quite difficult and i have only just starting using Autodesk Inventor and have ZERO cad experience but the rat box was pretty easy. Going to get one made up hopefully next week
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87175222/rat.JPG)
And here is the top unfolded. The plasma will take a DXF and burn this out of 1.5mm plate including the holes then off to the press break for bending . The bottom is 2mm
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87175222/rattop.JPG)
I wouldn't be able to get these made up for people but once I have tested the design I am quite happy to share the files. Any metal shop with a Plasma/laser/Water Jet would be able to make them in no time flat.
Is there anyone on here skilled in inventor?
Quote from: marmaliser on February 14, 2014, 09:25:02 PM
Quote from: culturejam on February 05, 2014, 04:54:37 AM
I would absolutely LOVE an unfinished (or even powdercoated) Rat-style box. Like the current Rat 2 / Turbo Rat size. I could live without the battery door, which would save in machining costs.
Or maybe slightly smaller all around would be idea. But I love the height and the accessibility when building.
(http://ratdistortion.com/wp-content/themes/ratdistortion/i/products/rat2_1_large.jpg)
The wedge box is quite difficult and i have only just starting using Autodesk Inventor and have ZERO cad experience but the rat box was pretty easy. Going to get one made up hopefully next week
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87175222/rat.JPG)
And here is the top unfolded. The plasma will take a DXF and burn this out of 1.5mm plate including the holes then off to the press break for bending . The bottom is 2mm
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87175222/rattop.JPG)
I wouldn't be able to get these made up for people but once I have tested the design I am quite happy to share the files. Any metal shop with a Plasma/laser/Water Jet would be able to make them in no time flat.
Is there anyone on here skilled in inventor?
I am not skilled in inventor but I am interested in the box files when you are ready. Thanks!
I will take the files.
Jacob
Same here, looks like a good way to start learning Inventor. I have it on my PC both at work and at home, but haven't had the time/stimulus to start looking in to it!
Paul
I sat down with a friend tonight who's a cad designer and worked out a box based on the Russian EHX boxes. I should have a couple proto's by next week or so, I'll post some pics and get a price together if there is any interest. The first few he's making out of scrap but after that I'll have to get a price for getting them made for real and have no idea how much that will be or if a larger volume order would bring the price down or not. We'll see.
Since I mentioned this in another thread. Here are the protos for the boxes we came up with. They have a couple of different angles from the Russian EHX boxes. They maintain the lip of the bottom piece over the top so you could use veneers without a border. We moved the screw mounts to the bottom to keep the face clean. You could use Dunlop style grommet/screw combos or just screws and adhesive stand offs. These were made by a metal fab shop but I'm looking at trying to make them myself. If I can get the price reasonable I'll look at making more models and offering them to you guys. Does this box look cool? What other designs would you like to see?
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/41/wq8x.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/15wq8xj)
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/21/sbod.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/0lsbodj)
(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/838/g4ma.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/nag4maj)
That's looking real good! I got some quotes on my original design, a single proto would be about 40 euros. A run of a 100 would drop it to 23 euros each. I think that including shipping, that would be a bit steep for re-selling, if I was able to front the 2300 euros.....
Paul
€23 is fairly steep, but I would be in for a few, say 4 to start with if you do it.
And regarding the powder coating idea from earlier in the thread, I don't mind doing it for people if they want the boxes done.
Sent from my thumbs using Tapatalk!
Fantastic... Looks like your cad guy knows his stuff. I don't sadly but here is my humble Rat proto
Would he be willing to share the model with me so i can have a look how it should be done ?
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87175222/photo%201.JPG)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/87175222/photo%204.JPG)
The proto as turned out slightly smaller so I need to adjust the K-Factors and bend allowances in the model
The Jack and power holes are a bit close together and bit close to the return so they have been adjusted
If you guys need any help, I have been using SolidWorks and Seimens NX for about 13 years and can assist with any CAD related issues you need.
I am interested in these enclosures as well!
Your rat box looks great! I don't have the files in hand just yet but I will soon and see if I can help with any questions.